Pricking Iron MADNESS, or genius?

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Got one as well from taobao link above. Took the olive teeth, as i prefer it this way.

It arrived yesterday, and i have to say it is a really cool tool for the money.

According to my calculations getting it from there would cost around 120USD for the entire set (8+2) of 3mm, 3.38mm, 3.85mm, 4mm including full set of teeth. Which is a cost of one 5+2 set of high quality irons Im currently using. And it would be an absolute winner. BUT the teeth, even though are nicely finished and smooth, are absolutely dull. Im using a small 250g rubber mallet, and it works absolutely fine with my current sharp irons. 5 teeth requires me 1 moderately hard blow. With these ones i was not able to pierce 3mm relatively soft veg tan leather no matter how many times i hit.

I have spent half a day trying different ways to sharpen them. I was working very carefully not to ruin the geometry. I used few fine grit sand papers, strop and felt disk on a rotary tool. The only thing i was able to achieve is 2 more of less sharp teeth which still requires same strength blow as my old 5 teeth one.

Is there any way to sharpen those teeth faster without ruining? Please advise if anyone have some tips.

I saw these right around the time that I saw this post and decided to give them a try. I bought some 4Z irons at the same time to compliment my Kevin Lee irons. Kevin Lee irons are 3.0, RCIDOS (these ones) are 3.38 and 4Z are 4.0.

My RCIDOS irons came in two days ago and I figured I'd give you all some first impressions. Full disclaimer, I have not used these for a project yet. If there is interest, I'll update once I have had a chance to.

Unboxed:

Compared to KL or 4Z irons, the shipping and presentation of these left a bit to be desired. Functional, but not pretty. I use the boxes that my KLs and 4Z's are packaged in to store them in my tool drawer, and to make sure they don't slide around when I open it. These came in individual plastic bags, both of which were wrapped in a bunch of bubble wrap, put diagonally in a box. They were protected well. It's on me to upgrade my storage game now.

Accuracy of machining:

See photos. The sliding tooth holders do not match up exactly with the handles. There was a little bit of overhang on both sides.

No real functional implications from what I can see yet.

The fit for the tooth holders sliding on to the handle is very good. No pinches, not loose. They got this right.

The screws that hold each tooth in, and hold the sliding tooth holder on (I know I'm killing it with these technical terms) feel much the same as the 4Z ones. They use an allen key (included), unlike the flat head of the 4Zs.

The 4Z teeth have a cylindrical base, that opens to a square section before transitioning to the tapered tooth. The cylindrical base is inserted into the drilled hole on the iron body. Orientation is dictated by the square section fitting into a rectangular recess at the end of the iron body. The RCIDOS iron tooth bodies (up to the taper) are entirely rectangular. These fit into rectangular holes on the tooth holder. I found most of the rectangular holes to allow free movement of the teeth, but 2-3 of them posed a challenge. I had to file down the rectangular sides of the teeth that fit in there in order to put them back.

Let's talk teeth:

My KLs and 4Z irons came sharp and ready to use right out of the box. The same can't be said for my RCIDOS. When you order RCIDOS irons, you select the type and size of teeth that you want. I chose 1.9mm Hex style (as opposed to Olive style). They included an olive style tooth for me.

(Olive on the left, hex on the right)

None of the teeth were sharp when I tried them.

That's after 3 heavy hits with my mallet. Great irons if you're going to prick and awl through the marks. I prefer to punch through.

I sharpened each tooth on a 3000 grit whetstone.

(Top: Olive shape, 2nd from top is not sharpened)

(L: Pre sharpening, R: Post sharpening)

With a bit of effort and a shaved down finger nail (a jig would have been fantastic), each tooth was sharpened and re-inserted. I know nothing about metal grades, types, carbon contents etc. I can't speak to the hardness of this metal, but each side of the tooth took about 15 forward and backward movements across a 10cm section of 3000 grit whetstone with medium pressure to sharpen. I gave each a second taper with a harsher angle.

Go easy on me, they're small.

With the teeth sharpened, I can easily push the iron through 2mm veg tan by hand.

Taper. The taper on these teeth are minimal. That is one thing that I was disappointed by with the 4Z irons. The taper on 4Z irons is significant compared to these ones.

(Top to bottom: Olive RCIDOS, sharpened RCIDOS hex, stock 4Z)

Cost:

KL 2+8 3.0 irons: $130CAD - 1 month wait (lead time) + Shipping with other items ($30USD).

4Z 2+9 4.0 irons: $178.19CAD - 1+ month (COVID) + Shipping ($13.98CAD).

RCIDOS 2+9 3.38 irons: $116.28 - 1+ month (COVID) + Shipping ($14.20).

Summary:

I don't know how to end this. They seem like they will perform reasonably after putting in some work. Again, if there is any interest, I'll update after completing a project or two with them. They're definitely rough around the edges (figuratively), but do have potential.

I reached out to the manufacturer and he said that they do not offer sharper teeth, and that the teeth are fine to punch through leather. Hmm.

If you have any questions, I'll do my best to answer!

From what I understand and again I am a newbie here is the width from center to center of the prick is standard such as 3.0 or 3.38 its the Hexagon shape stitching 1.5 to 2.1mm head that is a variable so I guess that is the width/depth of the prong? I also noticed this in a description of the WUTA pricking irons on another site. I will try the 3.38 with a 2.1mm prick.

Interesting.... what width would you suggest? They have hex 1.5 to 2.1mm available. maybe 1.5? I might buy a set to test them out.

Frank

The concept is pretty neat, however I am concerned with their durability if used as chisels (like the irons are being used by the modern crafters). Will the force of the punch transfer downwards fully, or will some of it deviate at the "joining" part and little by little destroy the mechanism?

With a design like this, the teeth mount from the side, i am guessing there will be issues. I would imagine a design where the end of the handle is hollowed and the teeth are inserted from the side, they will be craddled from both sides and the force will have to keep on going down instead of putting pressure on the machanism.

Hi there

Did you purchase and try them out? Seems they can beat the 4Z in some aspects as you don’t have to keep purchasing new handles each time !

This was something which turned me off slightly with 4Z.

I spoke to the seller from Rcidos and told them it would be great if they can add round tip prongs too.

They responded they will look into it, and asked me to contact them next week, most probably but due to the virus issue they are facing.

They had an olive shaped prong too, but don’t know if they are suitable for stitching flipping inside out leather bags.

Yea I saw them too, looks pretty cool. I'm really liking the new tools getting out lately. :)

I had converstaion with the seller of such pricking irons on Taobao.. he sad that they made from 4cr13 steel.. not very good for such tools I think.

Interesting. But is the handle really the expensive part that saves money?